I found this article this morning while browsing the new sites on the blogroll. Love the comparison between drug use and religion. Addicts are always addicted to something.
I think a great example of addictive behavior is the drug addict who is "saved" in rehab. Or the murderer who finds Jesus in prison..
http://singaporeatheists.blogspot.com/2008/07/religion-drugs.html
46 comments:
Wow. I must say his information is remarkable. oh, wait a sec, how did this person reach these conclusions? what evidence is there to suggest this?
Can you provide me with solid research?
Oh, and btw, before you accuse someone of targeting the illiterate, pick a Halleys Bible Handbook- one of the pastors I like listening will gladly hand this book out to any who ask him.
-Cannot be shaken
Lol. Cayden is my Singapore friend....
Beast
Hi interested:
I went through some of my older writings, and found this post which is quite similar to the subject of discussion:
http://atheisthaven.blogspot.com/2008/01/religion-soothing-balm-for-masses.html
Beast
First: you totally miss quoted II Corinthians 104&5
For the weapons of our warefare are not carnal but might in God for pulling down strongholds, casting down arguements and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obediance of Christ.
This means I have weapons (prayer and the word of God) to wage warefare with, rather than just with words. This last part means don't look at a woman who is not your wife and go hubba hubba
-CBS
Also Beast,
I do not believe your link has any validity to it because you do not show any scholarly evidence to believe it.
Simon Greenleaf was instrumental in dictating the rules behind evidentary law (was is admissable in court). Read his book "Testimony of the Evangelists".
Or, if his book is too hard for you, look at Lee Strobels book "The Case for Christ".
-CBS
LOL Interested
You sure have a lot of trolls lurking around, don't ya?
As for Lee Strobel's work, thanks but no thanks. Any half assed critic can debunk his work fairly easily, really.
So what kind of a scholarly evidence do you need? Sam Harris? Richard Dawkins? Or Steven Pinker?
Having gone to church and being a smoker, I think I am well-placed to comment on the startling similarity between drugs (nicotine is a drug) and religion.
Beast
Gawd! They are comming out of the woodwork today.
Guess I'll go look up your misquote, Beast.
Well, Paul was talking about the defense of his Ministry, probably from non-Jewish tribes.
Here's the complete verses from 1-6:
1By the meekness and gentleness of Christ, I appeal to you—I, Paul, who am "timid" when face to face with you, but "bold" when away! 2I beg you that when I come I may not have to be as bold as I expect to be toward some people who think that we live by the standards of this world. 3For though we live in the world, we do not wage war as the world does. 4The weapons we fight with are not the weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. 5We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ. 6And we will be ready to punish every act of disobedience, once your obedience is complete.
In that context, I don't think I have "misquoted" the bible, a charge most christians seem quite happy to heap upon me.
LOL
Beast
One more thing, CBS thinks the verse I quote is about "hubba hubba", i.e screwing someone's wife. I have read through the bible and found nothing mentioned with regards to lust.
Maybe CBS should read the bible again. Tsk Tsk.
intersted say what you want, it's your blog, so you can shut down the topics, but that shows me you are afraid and cannot handle the truth.
Sadly all of the stuff you heard and rejected will torment you and beast for all of eterinty. sad to be you. you joke and laugh now, but you have what, less than 50 years at best, figuring if you were to live to be 120, but thats rare people live that long. rick b
Lol
Judging by the size of your girth (No doubt a fast food fan), I will venture to say that you won't last the next ten years.
And then, guess what. God happens to be the Great Neptune of the Seas. Since you ain't Greek, and you don't associate yourself with Zeus, off you go to the fiery Greek Gates of hell!
Damn those Greeks!
LOL
Beast
-You are correct Rick. It is my blog and I gladly welcom intelligen discourse. However, name calling and the lack of new arguments make it less interesting. I'd love you to offer something to the conversation that is not bible based. The bible is only one source; a good researcher knows one must have several sources to be taken seriously.
Lee Strobel's "work" is more of the same. I have only given a cursory look at his website but it appears to be more of the same; bible based rhetoric.
Whats sad for you is this, You will stand before God and say, But I never knew. Then God will have the people like me who told you come forward and say, Yes you were told, and then you will cry like a little girl, and then be tormented by the thoughts of everything you were told.
Plus if I do die in the next 10 years or less, I say good, I suspect we will get nuked as a result of Iran admiting they want to do as much, way before I die. or as the bible predicts, russia and china will march upon isreal, then wont you and intersted fill your pants when you see prophecy come to pass, unless you die first.
I also find it funny, intersted says, I am open to hearing the truth, yet once she hears it, she shuts down all replies which only proves what a liar she really is, but God is not mocked or fooled, He knows and will repay her. rick b
rick b
Intersted said,
-You are correct Rick. It is my blog and I gladly welcom intelligen discourse. However, name calling and the lack of new arguments make it less interesting.
you are such a liar, how can you live with your self? I call names and you cry, Beast says real foul things like I,m an asshole or Fuck this person, and gives lame replies and you say, O-beast, you have such a way with words. that makes you A LIAR and a hyporcite. Plus your own words you say, I barely scanned this book or blog, and so it shows you refuse to be serious and look at the facts.
you and beast both know, If I said, sorry guys, I refuse to look or I barely looked at the evidence you have on your blogs, then you know very well you would question if I really want to know the truth. so that also shows your a liar. rick b
Give evidence outside the bible and I will listen and read and study until I learn.
...and further, why do you continue to harp on the same "hell fire and brimstone" speech? I don't see any evidence you have offered. I am asking now, please give me one piece of evidence that Jesus was a real person and not based on ancient pagen myths. Just one and remember you can use the bible, I've already read that "evidence"
of course I meant you can not use the bible. If that is the only evidence you have then it is not valid. Even in court there must be coroborating evidence, more than one source.
why is it you believe in people you never met and were not alive like George W, or Abe L?
you go by history books and eye witness accounts, yet when it comes to the Bible you refuse to view it the same way.
and as I have said before, the Bible is not one single book, or even to books, it is 66 books written by 40 different authors.
even reading a book from the OT speaking of lands before our time, we can see they exist and go visit them, plus through archelogoy we can prove places and people from the bible existed. then the dead sea scrolls prove this stuff, but as you and beast have shown already, no matter what your told or shown, you guys will find ways to prove it wrong or say it is false. rick b
interested said Give evidence outside the bible and I will listen and read and study until I learn.
you know why I do not believe you or will even say your lying? it is because people like Lee strobel or Josh Mc, both were like you, they were athiests and in Josh's case set out to prove the bible was false.
but from looking into the facts came to see the bible was real. any way these guys use evidence other than the bible and you openly admited you will not look at what they say or read their books.
so by your own mouth, you admit you really do not want to know.
then their are people and web sites that provide evidence for the bible from sources other than the bible, yet you refuse those.
also like I said, russia and china will march upon israel, dont know when, I just know it will be soon, I suspect less than 5 years with all thats going on.
plus one last piece, why does the entire world hate Isreal? what is it about a country that is about the size of new jersey that causes the entire middle east to want to destory them?
and if you answer with, it is religion, I would say, check your facts, about 90 percent or more of isreal is seculiar. so they also never believed in Jesus, that was why they killed him. rick b
Give me a specific source outside the bible that confirms that a man named Jesus lived and performed miracles and died on a cross. Just one. I am asking...not running. So produce one or shut up.
I disagree with what Rick has to say about China and Russia.
Russia is too busy with its former states to be anything but a threat to israel, and China hardly ever invades and country so far out of its reach.
Oh, btw, I am an Overseas Chinese.
Beast
"Beast says real foul things like I,m an asshole or Fuck this person, and gives lame replies and you say, O-beast, you have such a way with words. that makes you A LIAR and a hyporcite"
Talk about the pot calling the kettle black, Mr Rick. You called me a chicken and a pussy, remember? And who's the one saying that someone else has so many years to live, after which she will burn in perpetuity?
Come on Rick, if you want to abuse someone, be prepared to take shit in your face. You are not always the shitty victim. Typical Christian mentality really. When they can't win arguments they want to be abused housewives. Ain't cutting with me, mate!
Beast
"plus one last piece, why does the entire world hate Isreal? what is it about a country that is about the size of new jersey that causes the entire middle east to want to destory them?"
The world (Or practically most of the world) has some form of hatred towards the Jewish community because of historical reasons, not because they didn't believe in Jebus.
For one thing, the Jews themselves, situated in the middle of three continents in the middle east, didn't exactly endear themselves to the masses. Spawned from the legacy of an Egyptian slave population, their closeted culture and penchant to call other races "gentiles" meant that they were going to inspire hate amongst other tribes and races.
And the subsequent existence of the Catholic Church simply makes things worst: The Jews were considered the murderers of God, and hence anti Semitism was born.
Beast
"why is it you believe in people you never met and were not alive like George W, or Abe L?"
I guess Rick is not well versed with history.
Anyone who has ever existed and is famous, say, George Washington or Lincoln, will have either written volumes of books, letters, or journals that would have been either preserved or passed down in some shape or form. Others too, would have written about him, and if these things tallied, then yes, of course we know they exist.
Particularly Washington, who was, ahem, the first President of the United States.
Same thing with Julius Caesar. His conquests were recorded to the last minutiae. And a bust of him actually exists (Several busts, actually).
Beast
Interested
I can give you the identity of a man who not only walked through the great wall of china, he flew and made the statue of liberty disappear! How's that for a miracle?
His name?
DAVID COPPERFIELD!!!!!
Lol
Beast
Beast said Talk about the pot calling the kettle black, Mr Rick. You called me a chicken and a pussy, remember?
You need to read better, I did not complain about you calling me anything. Interested was crying I was saying things and I was pointing out she was being a hypocrite for telling me to stop but not you. it should be both or nothing, but as it always is, it is one sided.
Plus I'm glad you dont believe Russia and China will march against Isreal, so now when it happens It will prove I was correct, if the earthquakes in China dont kill you first. Rick b
Lol.
Of course an earthquake in China wouldn't kill me. I have been to China only once, and I am not even a Chinese citizen. I was born in Singapore, not China. Our my ancestral lineage in Chinese.
Lol again. I don't think Interested explicitly told you to stop. She merely closed the comments function from the previous post because well, blog comments shouldn't be allowed to escalate into a forum. Its not nice, and it is out of the original point of the post anyway.
Thanks again for telling me that I cannot read. For someone who reads and writes impeccable English, the last thing I need is an English lesson from a hill billy redneck like you.
Beast
(Triple Lolz)
Well Rick, what is your source? I am not running away, crying like a baby or shutting dow the conversation. I am open to new information so, if you can, provide me with some study material. I am anxious to begin a new study.
All right, here is what i am looking for as far as scholarly- obviously you have never written a serious paper!
Scholarly means you reference first hand research (you do a RANDOM poll of say, 10% of a given population which is shown- such as 10% of freshmen at NYU)- which is present in the Bibliography and it can be verified/ duplicated; quote other intelligent people who can show where there ideas come from.
If you look at Greenleaf or Strobel, you will find the scholarly evidence I am refering to.
The fact you write this off as rhetoric tells me you just don't care to know the truth about the matter.
And you can (have the ability; same as I do) to go to Hell.
-CBS
Where is there any coroborating evidence outside the bible?
Anon I am searching frantically and I do not find the scholarly references of which you speak. Please provide a link or other information. I really do want to see the evidence.
Hey, CBS
I do know how to do a research paper, with references and so on and so forth.
But Mr Genius:
I AM WRITING A BLOG, NOT A RESEARCH PAPER!!!!! If I start writing with a scholastic touch, pretty soon, my readership will become a big, fat 0.
Please do not insult my intelligence. I am not as stupid as you think I am.
Beast
intersted, you said On my blog you seem to epitomize hate of non believers.
I dont hate you guys, if you think I do because I tell you your on your way to hell, then so be it. If what I believe is true, then it would be hateful for me to not speak to you.
But telling you the truth is not hate. Rick b
Interested, I do not know if you can make Hot links in a blog reply or not, but put this in and it will have some info on Jesus from the secular people.
http://www.doxa.ws/Jesus_pages/HistJesus6.html
Rick b
Another source.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/maps/primary/pliny.html
Rick b
Yes, Rick. Calling people pussies and chickens isn't hate. Just plain childishness for a middle-aged man.
The kind of prudish behavior I see from Rick, and the not-so-intelligent comments from CBS, I sometimes wonder why you guys ever show up at all. You guys don't play nice, don't want to discuss things in a rational manner, and resort to thuggery, skulduggery and fire-and-brimstone preaching to get your points across. Frankly, haven't you Americans got enough of this nonsense after 8 yrs of terror from the Bush Administration?
Interested, I must applaud you for your courage to even tolerate these morons, seriously. I wouldn't mind a Christian who can seriously debate theology, but these bunch of trolls just don't make the grade.
Seriously
Beast
Beast-
You rude, abnoxious... "not-so-intelligent comments from CBS, I sometimes wonder why you guys ever show up at all."
I have done what I can to keep this discussion as intellegent as I know how.
My sarcastic comment only reflects your question of Scholarly. Surely you can find information on the web which would back up your statements! And I am being completely serious here.
-CBS
Intel-
as far as evidence which goes beyond the Bible, there are accounts by Josephus (a non-religious Jew, BTW)
http://wesley.nnu.edu/biblical_studies/josephus/
there are evidences of why we can trust the Gospel of Matthew, but not the Gospel of Thomas- the 40/80 rule. this is used to verify ancient texts.
There are many ways OTHER than the Bible we can know this. All of these are documented in "Case for Christ" and certainly by Simon Greenleaf.
-CBS
Lol CBS
Funny you mentioned Josephus. We know that most, if not all his works pertaining to the mythical Jebus was a complete fabrication, probably done by St Ignacius. In fact, Josephus mentions 20 other Jebuses, each close, but not exactly the same as the biblical Jebus.
As for Lee Strobel's books, I suggest you do not quote them. If I start lambasting Lee Strobel's works, you won't like it. Its gonna be long and verbose, so......
Beast
Say what you want Beast, But the crap started with you, All I did was reply in the same way, Does that make it Right? Or me perfect? Nope, never once did I make that Claim.
Then you can say what you want, But I and others do provide Evidence or Facts and you either refuse to view them or simply dismiss them.
Then when I called you Chicken and a pussy, it was around the fact that you cannot Spell Jesus, so that tells me your scared.
I know you will deny that, but I gotta say, for a person that claims a God or deity does not exist, you seem to be awfully scared to even mention His name or spell it out.
Like the Bible says, Even the demons believe and tremble. I never said your stupid or called you names in that sense of the word, I simply said, your a coward for not being able to spell out the name of a God you claim does not exist.
Then on the issue of Hell, I am in no way trying to scare you by bringing it up, Jesus himself spoke more about Hell and the Fire that awaits than he did about Heaven. He even spoke about A rich man in torment.
Plus not saying it makes it right, just that none of us are perfect, you can find many examples of Men of God mocking or trash talking non believers who's only goal is to them selves mock God or lead people astray.
And I know you will say, But I dont mock God, say what you want, but you really do. Rick b
Beast Said Funny you mentioned Josephus. We know that most, if not all his works pertaining to the mythical Jebus was a complete fabrication, probably done by St Ignacius. In fact, Josephus mentions 20 other Jebuses, each close, but not exactly the same as the biblical Jebus.
Man, you really need to read the Books better, Josephus never spoke of a man named Jebus, your Correct, that Guy Jebus never existed, He did speak of a Jesus, and Jesus did exist, You cannot fight or argue about a person who never existed with people who agree with you. So me in quotes where me or CBS claim to believe in this (Jebus) you speak of, we speak of Jesus, not Jebus. Rick b
Rick CBS
This has gone far enough. Your evidence is lacking almost as much as your manners. I am closing this and we will begin afresh tomorrow.
Rick CBS
This has gone far enough. Your evidence is lacking almost as much as your manners. I am closing this and we will begin afresh tomorrow.
Rick CBS
This has gone far enough. Your evidence is lacking almost as much as your manners. I am closing this and we will begin afresh tomorrow.
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