Wednesday, February 24, 2010

Vengful God, I Guess!

One of my favorites, listed to the right, is the God of the Bible site. It is a skeptic’s guide to the atrocities of god of the bible. I went there this morning looking for a passage in James. Why?
Well, yesterday I took my car in for an oil change and while waiting for it I picked up a book Life-Lessons: Book of James-Practical-Wisdom. Never having seen it before, I began to read. It starts out telling about the author and that he is believed to be the brother of Jesus. I wasn’t there long enough to finish it but I think the idea is to use the bible to glean practical lesson applicable to living in today’s world. Nice idea; I guess.
So….my curiosity got the best of me and I decided to check out the book of James. That took me to the aforementioned website. From there I got to another site which gives a count of how many people god killed, based on the bible. How many has God killed? WOW!

So check it out. Bet you didn’t know what a ruthless guy your god is.


Rick b said...

What you seem to purposely ignore is God warns the people well in advance and gives them time to repent. But you guys always leave out that information. Rick b

Interested said...

Warning or not, a loving god would not be so mean.

Anonymous said...

Where was the chance to repent for the 50070 he killed for looking in a box or the 42 kinds that were mauled by a bear for making fun of Elijah? Stop lying rick.

Rick b said...

Interested, You can say God is not loving because he kills people, what you either do not understand or do, but dont care is this.

If you read the Bible, Anyone that hates God or his people are His Enemies, If you attack his people the you pretty much are attacking him.

Say what you want, but if you try and break into my house and use a knife or gun and try killing my family, I will kill you. If you try and harm Gods people He will pay you back.

But then even in places where God kille people that were not trying to harm His people, Like Noahs ark for example, There was simply so much evil and they simply hated God to the point where he cleaned the earth of them, But he did give them 200 years to repent before hand.

Then the other thing is, Like it or not, God created us and the world, we pretty much belong to Him and he can do as he pleases.

Noreligion, Funny how you say I am lying. How exactly did I lie? The Bible verses you mention, I did not say that, the Bible did, So I never lied.

But funny how you call me A liar, I showed you were wrong about the Bible and either lied or are simply that ignorant, Then you in turn call me names and threaten me. I can at least answer the questions. You guys might not like or agree with the answers, but I can at least answer them. Rick b

Interested said...

Rick please stop preaching. I have read it all before and you know it falls on deaf ears. If you want to make a constructive comment, do so. However, no more evangelizing.

Rick b said...

interested, How am I evangelizing?
You asked a question and I answered it. Also why do you post these topics if you do not want Christians replying?

If all you get is people reply and saying, wow I totaly aggree then whats the point?

Also you must reliese that when you post these topics Christians view that as both an attack on what we believe and what to set the record straight, and we/I believe as I said before your leaving out information and what to add it.

Again an example would be, If you say, The Bible teaches that God flooded the earth and killed possibly 6 billion people, that seems vengful to me and left it at that, I would question you about leaving out the part how God gave the people 200 years to repent.

Now if you said, I believe God is vegful for killing 6 billion people, but the Bible teaches before He did it He gave them 200 years to repent, But to Me that still is not Fair and here is why, that would be much different. At least I would say your being fair and balanced by showing both sides even if you do not aggree. Rick b

Interested said...

I am not posting for Christians. I post for my own purposes. If you as a Christian come here you must be looking for something. You don't need to defend god or the bible. If you believe it...fine..just stop trying to save me. And by the way I did not pose a question in this post, so stop trying to answer an unasked question.

Rick b said...

You might not have posed a question, but you did make a claim from the Bible, saying God is vengful, I'm simply stating God is not that way and why. I'm not asking you to believe what I say, I'm simply doing as you do. Your putting out info and I'm simply adding to what you leave out. Rick b

Nicole said...

I just love the book of James! It is chock full of practical information for life. It paralells Jesus' Sermon on the Mount (in Matthew 23, I think).

You know, it just occurred to me the other day that when you read the Bible, you are reading someone else's mail. No wonder you don't understand what's being said.

With that being said, you also need a "heart transplant". You need to replace the hard, stony heart with a fleshy compassionate one. You can't read the Bible looking for mistakes and errors and with a jaded outlook. Of course it won't make sense to you. Now, I'm not calling you stupid or dumb, I'm just saying you can't interpret something when you have the wrong heart.


Interested said...

So heart is not right so I can't read the bible correctly? I guess I could say the same to you about reading Dawkins, The god delusion or Hitchens', God is not great.

Anonymous said...

A lot of times when 'religion' is blamed,the real reason was something else.
(e.g., "We want their land, oil, salt, gold, etc.," or "He doesn’t recognize my right to be his ruler.")
Most of the time, it's actually over money or land or possession or power, rather than religion.

For example, I knew a guy that was visiting from Ireland, a number of years ago. I asked him
about the Protestant-Catholic wars over there, and he said it wasn't about religion at all, but that
the media was the one who made it sound like a religious war.

Stalin, Pol Pot, and Mao Tse Tung were all atheists,
and killed around 20 million, 1.5 million, and 40 million respectively. However, if you say that Communism is not the same as Atheism, or that those killings were
not done in the 'name' of Atheism that would basically be splitting hairs.

If you say that Communism is not Atheism, you could say that a core component of Communism
was state Atheism, and that the aspects of it that were directed against religious people were therefore
atheist in their component. This became a core component of many communist regimes.
The Khmer Rouge in Cambodia was Atheist, and most notoriously slaughtered everyone,
with Buddhist monks at the top of the list.

People are sinful, wicked and greedy. Wars are caused because of sin. Killing is done because
of sin, and often because of the desire for wealth or power. If religion is a driver, its absence
will only eliminate that particular driver, not eliminate human aggression. And, if religion is sometimes
a driving force in wars, at the same time, it also provides a clearly-stated set of ethics for proper behavior,
which is lacking in Atheism. (However, note that Atheists can be highly ethical---they are not all necessarily

Atheism does not normally rouse the same passions as religion, but on the other hand it does not provide
the same guidance as religion, and state policy unfettered by the morality aligned with religion is an unrestrained
and very scary concept.

Interested said...

Not scary to me. I would welcome a place where religious superstition is non-existent. And don't forget how many people have been killed in the name of religion; not just those in the bible but in our time; the crusades, 9-11 to name two.

Rick b said...

interested said I would welcome a place where religious superstition is non-existent.

It will never happen, according to the Bible we are headining towards a one world goverment and one world religion. But id you say, well I dont believe the Bible, look to our goverment and world dictators.

They openly speak of wanting a one world leader and goverment. Many are athiests or believers in a different religion, so it seems the Bible Got that one correct. Rick b

Nicole said...

Interested said: "my heart is not right so I can't read the bible correctly? I guess I could say the same to you about reading Dawkins, The god delusion or Hitchens', God is not great."

Yes you could...;)

Interested said: "I am not posting for Christians. I post for my own purposes."

I find it extremely interesting that there are so many Christians on this blog. I was reading the past topics and I was amazed to find that Rick has been on here for like 3 years. There is also myself, Shelli and Jeff. You seem to think we are here looking for answers, but I disagree. We have a desire to help people understand the Lord's point of view. Rick does this with such passion and verve. (Yes he can seem abrasive, but he's effective none-the-less.) Shelli and Jeff come across as highly educated people and their posts reflect that. And myself, I just have a compassionate heart and I like chatting with you about these sorts of things.

You ask "Why are we here?" the answer is simple: providence. It was meant to be. I feel there's no denying that. You will reject this I'm sure. It's just coincidence, right? We have nothing better to do so we come terrorize you with Jesus?

I cannot speak for the others, but I feel compelled to post here. I need to keep chatting with you about your posts, about anything. I hope and pray that something I write will hit home with you. That you will ask me the questions that you previously wanted the answers for. I feel sad that the people you asked before didn't know the answers or didn't care enough about you to find out the answers for you. This my sound weird to you. Of course it would, because you do not know the true heart of God.


Gosh, sorry for my rambling post. I'm a bit emothional because my auntie past away on Sunday 2/21.

Anon: interesting points, all!

Interested said...

Interesting Nicole. I lost my aunt on Sunday also. He funeral is today.

Interested said...

Her funeral is today.

Rick b said...

Nicole, I know I come across Harsh, but then I admit I am the the pansy waste Christian that refues to speak the truth for fear of offending people type of Christian that exists today.

As you know from Scripture, Jesus and the apostles make me look tame in how they spoke. Sorry about both of your losses, Hopefully they know Jesus and have not been cast out of His presance for all of eternity.

PS, About me being abrasive, Part of it comes when I am accused of lying and I did not lie, as I said to Nonreligion, He/She accused me of lying, well like I asked, where or how did I lie?

On a former post I did admit I made a mistake in mis-quoting them, I admited that fact, but also provided evidence that they had no clue what they were talking about. Unlike me who admited I made a mistake, they could only call me names and threaten me.

Funny how us Christians get accused for stuff but yet some, not all athiets are far worse in what they do or say to us and no one says boo to them. Rick b

Nicole said...

Rick: I hope you know my comment was not to slam you. (My father and brother are the same way.) I apologize if you took offense. I actually desire to be more like you. To be a bold witness for Christ. I read with anticipation what you will say next! It's like I'm a junkie! LOL. Thanks for your condolances.

Interested: I'm sorry for the loss of your aunt. This is never easy, no matter what theology one has.

Rick B said...

Nicole, It is next to impossible to offend me, The thing that bothers me or you could say offends me is when people call me a liar but cannot support why. If I call anyone on this blog a liar, I ALWAYS give a reason for saying it. I dont simply say, so and so is a liar and leave it at that. Rick b

Anonymous said...

It is a lie. You said god always gives a time to repent. What was that for the 50070 god killed for looking in a box and what was it for the 43 kids god had a bear kill? If there was no period that god gave them to repent, you lied plain and simply. Not admitting it compounds your dishonesty.

Anonymous said...

42 not 43. Was a typo.

Anonymous said...

What about the absurd slayings of 600 philistines with an ox goad (cattle prob) in Judges 3:31 and the slaying of 1000 with the jawbone of a donkey in Judges 15:15, where was the repentance there?

Nicole said...

noreligion: perhaps this footnote from the amplified bible may help explain 2Kings 2:23:

This incident has long been misunderstood because the Hebrew word "naar" was translated "little boys." That these characteristic juvenile delinquents were old enough to be fully accountable is obvious from the use of the word elsewhere. For example, it was used by David of his son Solomon and translated "young and inexperienced," when Solomon was a father (I Chron. 22:5; cf. I Kings 14:21 and II Chron. 9:30 ). It was used of Joseph when he was seventeen (Gen. 37:2). In fact, not less than seventy times in the King James Version this word "naar" is translated "young man" or "young men."

Rick B said...

Non, I did not lie. If you read the Bible God warns people, Do not do this or that, if you do you will die. They are warned of what will come if they do certain things.

So thats not a lie, they know in advance. But since you want to call me a liar, How about you tell me how it is you think your so smart about knowing the Bible, when under your topic of hell I openly exposed you as the clueless fraud you are. Your only two reply's too me were, Rick your an asshole, wow, thats a good reply? Calling me names. Then you threatened me, yep, thats showing me. If thats your only reply, why should I take you seriously? Rick b

Anonymous said...

You didn't say....What you seem to purposely ignore is God warns the people well in advance and gives them time to repent. But you guys always leave out that information. Rick b

But it's ok, you guys always lie.

Rick B said...

We always lie? It's you who cannot answer questions, you can only swear and make threats. You need to threaten me because you were exposed as a fraud and liar and God forbid your mindless followers see that you could not handle the truth.

Anonymous said...

Nicole, read the word before na'ar and it is qatan. The correct translation is little children. Your god is a vengeful, egotistical, homophobic, misogynistic barbarian.

Rick B said...

Non said Nicole, read the word before na'ar and it is qatan. The correct translation is little children. Your god is a vengeful, egotistical, homophobic, misogynistic barbarian.

How can we/I trust you to know what your talking about? I showed you how you were wrong about the topic of hell. Plus you and interested keep making these claims about God being vengeful and cruel.

How is God cruel when He gave everyone over 100 years to repent before flooding the earth, When Jonah went to tell Nineveh they would be destroyed, they repented and God spared them, Then Jonah was mad at God for not destroying them and God rebuked Jonah.

It was Pharaoh who enslaved Gods people, God sent Moses, God warned Pharaoh before doing anything, It was Pharaoh who refused to let the people go. By the Time God came to the last plague God told everyone, including the pharaoh and all the Egyptians, if you under the blood, in the house with the lambs blood on the door you will be saved, but if your a Jew and your not under the blood you will die.

Pharaoh let them go after that, but then changed his mind and went back after the slaves. God showed grace and warned these people, so how is that cruel? Rick b

Anonymous said...

Where is the chance he gave those 42 to repent? Where is the chance he gave to 50070 in Beth Shemesh a chance to repent? Where is the chance he gave the 600 Philistines a chance to repent before having them poked to death with a cattle prod? Where is the chance to repent he gave to the 1000 Philistines that he had Samson slaughter with the jawbone of a donkey? Provide them or the fact is you lied but what difference is it to a Christian when their hero Paul condones it in 2 Corinthians 12:15-16. Anyway,I really couldn't care if you trust, believe or hate me.

Rick b said...

I have nothing to prove to you, you could care less about what ever I say. But if you even want a reply it is like this, Can You or I kill people that want to kill us? I say yes, Can you or I defend our family's or loved ones from people trying to kill them? I say yes.

So unless you say no, we must simply allow our family to be killed or die ourselves, then I say to the question you asked, in most cases those people that died were enemies of God that tried to kill His people. Either He fought to defend His people or he sent others to do it, Like Samson for example.

Then in the few cases that you want to argue that God did not give them time to repent, go back and re-read the Bible. God laid out laws in great detail about how if you do these certain things you will live and be blessed, and if you do these certain things you will die.

They knew in advance, Since people knew in advance, then that shows Grace and love from God, Not God simply saying, I will kill them because I want to. But then again you dont care and you dont really want to know, because you will still write articles on your blog that are wrong and misleading, but yet you will act as if you really know what your talking about. Sort of like your topic on hell. Your wrong and you know it, but yet you do not care, you lie to people and when you were exposed you replied with name calling and threats. Rick b

Anonymous said...

So your not gonna show where there was time to repent in any of those four instances. Glad to know you lied when you said god always gives time to repent.

Rick B said...

non, do you read only what you want and ignore the rest?

I did clearly state that in the cases that God did not give them time to repent that there was a reason. I said that God wiped out his enemies, I do not stand before a guy breaking into my house or trying to rob me and tell him, repent and I wont harm you, I just will kill you.

Then I did say, all these people knew in ADVANCE, Notice I said, they knew before hand that if they attack God or His people they will die, They knew before hand that there were laws and if they broke them they would pay for it. But I guess you missed when I said all that stuff.

If your stretching to find problems because I did not spell things out the first time, then thats your problem. Like I said before I can admit if I made a mistake, but you cannot.

Lets see, how can I spell this out for someone who refuses to listen, O-I guess I cannot. Rick b

Anonymous said...

Which means and gives them time to repent was a lie.

Interested said...

It still seems to me that the god of the bible is one mean dude. Warning or not, what father kills his own children, whatever they do. Unconditional love is just that unconditional. And if his children are not perfect then, according to the bible, he made them in his own image. 'nuff said.